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Race/Ethnicity Questions 511-520

THE QUESTION:
R520: When holding a conversation with black friends, why do I feel uncomfortable about mentioning anything related to their race? I know I’m not racist, but for some reason I feel like I would offend them. Is this common among whites?
POSTED NOV. 17, 1998
Mary B., 49, white female, Union City, CA

ANSWER 1:
Like the questioner, I too at times feel uncomfortable around minorities for the reason she named. It seems that as a white person, especially one who holds politically incorrect opinions, you have to be ready to apologize with every other breath when talking to or about minorities, out of fear of being labeled a racist. Since we do not live in a time of free inquiry regarding topics of race, I would recommend you do not volunteer your opinions. And if someone questions you on such topics, put them off by saying you are offended at being asked such a question.
POSTED NOV. 23, 1998
Mark S., 30, white <xsites@aol.com>, Houston, TX
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THE QUESTION:
R519: I’ve read different news articles recently about how African Americans see nothing wrong with President Clinton’s affair with Monica Lewinsky, and reject traditional morals. Do African Americans really feel differently than whites about the issues of marital fidelity and truthfulness? I’m not racist, I just want to know.
POSTED NOV. 16, 1998
Lou F., 40, white male <lflum@iac.net>, Cincinnati, OH

ANSWER 1:
I am a little surprised by this question, namely why it was let out on the Y? Forum. I am a white person who sees nothing wrong with Clinton’s affair, and to assume that all African Americans condone or even think in a block on this topic is racist. Is it the assumption that all whites are condemning and want him out, and thus how could blacks be so different? I think you know what you are trying to say, but you don’t have the courage to face your own feelings of anger over the Clinton/Republican/Starr thing.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Matthew, 40ish, white, gay, New York, NY

FURTHER NOTICE:
I think the difference lies in that African Americans view the issue as one of hypocrisy, not morality. Further, I feel we as African Americans have developed a keen sensitivity to double standards and phony righteousness. Our history as the objects of such treatment makes it difficult not to sympathize with a person being subjected to the kind of mean-spirited scrutiny that has marked the Starr persecution. We most certainly don’t condone infidelity, or other moral transgressions. However, perhaps the more relevant moral issue we see is “Let he who is without sin throw the first stone.”
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
S.F., male, black <sfinley@wans.net>, Naperville, IL

FURTHER NOTICE 2:
I am an African American, or black American, or Negro, whatever, from Cincinnati. We both know just how extremely conservative this city is and its thinking. So let me try to give you my opinion. What the President did was much more than just extremely stupid. It was not something black people see as good or proper behavior. Infidelity is a bad thing, no matter who does it. But it has been so very long since black people have found a President willing to listen, and what you hear and see is black people trying to protect their political interest. Every President has done something to been impeached for, it’s just that President Clinton was told on by an immature 21-year-old who was recorded by someone looking to get the goods on a President she feels should be removed. If you look at the previous two Presidents, you can point them directly to drug trafficking, through support of the Contras. There were no tape recordings of the specifics, thus Reagan and Bush got away with it, and those drugs were sold right here in America. I found that white Americans flocked to the defense of Reagan, just as blacks to the defense of Clinton. I think drug trafficking is far, far worse than any amount of infidelity. It is not a matter of morality, Christian beliefs or fidelity. It is a matter of politics, power and influence. And after President Carter, black people had to wait 12 long years to have any kind of influence with a President. And President Clinton has hired more blacks into his Presidency than any other President in history. I think black people will overlook a lot to maintain this. There are far worse things a President could have done. Even the great Ike had a mistress, along with Roosevelt, Kennedy and many others, including Thomas Jefferson and George Washington. People will just be human…
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Tony, 43, black American male, <cinatisoulman@mailexcite.com>, Cincinnati, OH

FURTHER NOTICE 3:
Lou, be careful not to believe everything you read in the papers. African Americans are just as diverse in their thinking and opinions as any other ethnic group. Without attempting to speak for the entire African-American community, I will say that some (including myself) have chosen to separate the sin from the job. While Mr. Clinton did lie about his sexual encounters with Ms. Lewinsky, I submit to you that that has nothing to do with the price of tea in China; that is, his job performance. I also ask how many other public servants, if their own sex lives were publicly scrutinized, would walk away clean? I suspect that both sides of the aisle at the Capitol would require some 409 to remove the stains! As for the moral issue, it is precisely why I, and perhaps other African Americans, support Mr. Clinton. As the scripture goes, “Let he without sin cast the first stone.” Many Americans are quick to stand in moral judgment, but refuse to look in the mirror and acknowledge their own daily transgressions.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
R. Mitchell <rdm2@vwarch.com>, Chicago, IL

FURTHER NOTICE 4:
Lou, it sounds like the articles you’ve been reading were written by someone trying to stir the pot of ignorance and miseducation (fancy that happening in the political arena). As an African American who was raised as a strict Christian, I feel Clinton’s actions were immoral and wrong. However, under the laws of our nation, they were not illegal and therefore not subject to questioning in a legal forum. As to African Americans feeling differently about marital infidelity and truthfulness, consider that for generations many blacks have accepted that Sally Hemmings was not only Thomas Jefferson’s slave, but also his mistress and the father of (at least) one of his children. Whites traditionally have denied this fact (recently proven through DNA analysis) out of hand, reasoning that so great an architect of freedom and democracy (in spite of engaging in the most obvious contradiction of enslaving his fellow human beings) could never stoop to such philandering. The point is that blacks value truthfulness and fidelity just as much as anyone, but perhaps we recognize that all humans, great and small, are capable of cheating and lying about it, and we aren’t in a hurry to throw stones from inside glass houses (a la Henry Hyde and Dan Burton).
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Sam, 30, male, brown American <SamAlex67@aol.com>, Chicago, Il

FURTHER NOTICE 5:
As an African-American woman, I support President Clinton. That support does not mean I have abandoned traditional morals or believe Clinton’s behavior was acceptable. It was clearly not right to cheat on his wife. The reason he gets my support is that he is being attacked by people who are not “without sin” themselves. Look at the Republicans who condemned him and then were revealed to have had affairs years before. Look at the revelations about Starr’s contact with Paula Jones’ attorneys and the appearance of collusion in his selection as a replacement for the “not rabid enough” prosecutor who was there first. I see people playing politics with a private marital issue. He was deceitful and wrong to have an affair, but his punishment should come from Hillary, Chelsea and God, not the Congressional hypocrites.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Diane, African-American female, Durham, NC

FURTHER NOTICE 6:
I am a white woman who happens to socialize with primarily other white people. While I am appalled at the Clinton-Lewinsky affair, most people I know really don’t care, don’t think it’s “our business,” and don’t think it’s really that big a deal. I’m not familiar with the articles you read that specify African-American reaction, but in my experience, plenty of white people have abandoned traditional morals on this issue.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Michelle, 26, white female, St. Louis, MO

FURTHER NOTICE 7:
I don’t think African Americans are so more less tolerant of Bill Clinton’s actions or that we are rejecting “traditional” moral values. I would be appalled if my boyfriend did what the President did and I would wring his neck! However, when you live your life knowing what it’s like to be misjudged or persecuted, you have a tendency to be a little more tolerant. One also has to remember that Bill Clinton has done a lot during his two administrations to advance the causes of African Americans and women and has appointed women and minorities to Cabinet posts, judgeships, etc. We tend to be more forgiving and definitely don’t bite the hand that has fed us. Also, Clinton has steered the country into prosperity, and I believe that has a lot to do with tolerance as well. Clinton has had a record of standing by African Americans with his actions, and therefore we will stand by him. At least, I will.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Tiffany T., 25, African-American female, Houston, TX

FURTHER NOTICE 8:
We hold the same moral code as most people. It’s not that we see nothing “wrong” with extramarital affairs, but, like many people of all races, I don’t think Clinton’s personal life is my business. I, personally, do not want to hear about anyone’s sexual liaisons with someone other than their husband/wife. It’s not my business. Yes, he is the President. However, I don’t feel his affair with Lewinsky affected his handling of his job, and therefore, it is not my business. He is not the only person, man or woman, to have had an extramarital affair. This happens all the time, everyday, to everyone. No one else (well, not many, anyway) has their personal business put out for all to see.

Also, not many bosses’ names are trashed when caught having an affair with the secretary or any other employee. They are not prosecuted for having the affair. I’d think that most of the people who found out about the affair would think it was wrong, but, as I said before, would also think it was none of their business. They would be disgusted, but as long as it didn’t interfere with the man’s/woman’s handling of his/her job, I doubt anyone would really care. Also, I think many people, not only black, see this scandal as a set-up. After all, what kind of woman saves a semen-stained dress? Not a very stable one. And maybe it could have been hidden better if Ken Starr had not been like a dog after a cat. I believe Starr had to find “something” to justify spending millions of taxpayers’ dollars on the Paula Jones scandal. He couldn’t afford to do otherwise. But who cares? It’s time to move on. I believe many people, black and otherwise, think this same money could have been put to better use in education or some other worthy cause. I’m tired of hearing about it, having my favorite programs interrupted with “new” news on it and would like the whole thing to be put to rest so we Americans can focus on improving things here at home.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Whitney T., 19, black female belonging to neither the Democratic nor Republican party, <scrumpies@juno.com>, Oxford, MS

FURTHER NOTICE 9:
I don’t know who they were polling, but I for one am not impressed with Bill’s infidelity. It is true that infidelity is, in some areas of black communities, thought of as cute, OK or even expected … but not in my house. I am sure “cheating” is considered OK or at least a dirty secret among whites, too. (I know of a girl who is living with her baby’s father and her current boyfriend. Who does she sleep with? She’s cheating on somebody. Anyway, the point is, “A dog is a dog is a dog,” no matter what color. The only difference is Bill has more money than most of us. To general society, if you have money, then anything you do is considered OK because if you get into trouble, you pay Johnny Cochran-type lawyers to bail you out. Cheating is never OK, as Bill is finding out.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Chandra, 22, black <randolph@ismie.com>, Chicago, IL

FURTHER NOTICE 10:
This question assumes all white people feel the same way the writer does. I am a 26-year-old white female, and I can honestly say I couldn’t care less about the private life of our elected leader, unless it breaks laws. The question I’ve had in my head for quite a while is, Why does it seem that men are more offended by the President’s actions than women? I come to this conclusion by listening to the opinions of the men I work with, overhearing conversations between men and women on the subject, reading letters to the editor, and even in such magazines as The New Yorker (where I would think that viewpoints would be a little more liberal). Maybe black people don’t feel the hypocritical need to state to the world how “moral” they are, like white men do.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Amber, 26, white female, Las Vegas, NV

FURTHER NOTICE 11:
Those articles could not have possibly asked all 33 million African Americans what they think about marital fidelity. Each and every one of us feels differently. For my part, I care about what my husband is doing. I really don’t think that what Clinton does sexually is anyone else’s business except Hillary’s. Of course, I can only speak for myself. No one can speak for an entire race. We are individuals who happen to share some physical characteristics. One fact that might be clouding the issue of race and marital fidelity is that blacks from other countries are visually lumped in with American blacks. And other countries have different mores than Americans. There are many cultures where fidelity is not expected or required. And there are certainly many, many Americans of all races who break their marriage vows. It is not something that can be litigated.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Jesse D., 35, African-American female, Chicago, IL

FURTHER NOTICE 12:
While I can’t speak for all African Americans, I will say that we have always been considered a very forgiving people. I don’t condone what President Clinton has done with Monica Lewinsky or any other woman who has claimed to have been with him. I do feel that this is a personal matter that need only be discussed with Hillary and Chelsea. While I’m at it, let me say that none of his extramarital affairs are cause for impeachment.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Janet, 33, African American, Capitol Heights, Md

FURTHER NOTICE 13:
I’ve read some of the same press, and I don’t get the impression that African Americans think less of marriage vows than European Americans. I believe what you are seeing is that most African Americans (myself included) are rallying around our president. I understand that “misleading the public” was somewhat short of morally bankrupt of him to do, however, I see this as a mistake, and I can’t say if I would or would not have done the same thing if I were in his shoes (we already have witness that many ex-presidents as well as Republican politicians have done the same thing). I see this president as finally giving African Americans a voice in the White House; the talks on race relations may be just “talks,” but it’s a start. But getting back to the point, African Americans do not view truthfulness differently than European Americans. Some just disagree with your view of the situation.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Demetris <demetris@earthlink.net>, Frederick, MD

FURTHER NOTICE 14:
African Americans, as a whole, have more insight and experience on being the accused and the underdog than white people. Because we know first-hand that the government can be the enemy, that there can be trumped-up charges, we are more inclined to give an accused the benefit of the doubt. Fidelity in the marital unit is just as important to African Americans as it is to whites.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
27, black female <caramel@hotmail.com>, Jackson, MS

FURTHER NOTICE 15:
Rather than saying there’s nothing wrong with the Clinton-Lewinsky affair or rejecting traditional morals, I and most of my friends feel this is a personal matter and not our responsibility to judge such personal items in such a public arena. I would not have married the man, but that’s not what we elected him for. I tend to feel that a lot of white Americans are somewhat hypocritical on this matter; for example, holding up the “Founding Fathers” as examples of moral rectitude (truthfulness, at least in the political arena, has always seemed to be more expedient than not).
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
André, Houston, TX

FURTHER NOTICE 16:
I have yet to hear a black religious person say that Clinton was right to do what he did. They do not defend his actions in any way. So it is not true that blacks are less moral (that’s racist, by the way). However, keep in mind that blacks and other minorities are traditionally Democratic in their politics. Without pressing my point too far, black religious groups “forgiving” Clinton is much like the mostly white Christian Coalition “forgiving” Newt Gingrich for his possible ethics violations. Had it been Ronald Reagan or George Bush (both Republican presidents) who had been charged with these same crimes, I would have expected black religious leaders to have strongly backed impeachment, just as the CC is pushing for Clinton’s ouster. In short, when the matter is political, you have to look for the political angle!
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
John K., 25, <the-macs@geocities.com>, Cranford, NJ

FURTHER NOTICE 17:
I believe President Clinton should be thrown out of office, not because I believe he is a disgusting man, but because his behavior shows a lack of respect for his wife, daughter, his party and basically the entire American public. If he can risk everything for something so petty, even as he is being investigated for other similar acts, it says to me he isn’t one who should be trusted. In my experience, marital fidelity and morality are just as important to blacks as whites. I think the reaction you see in some of the polls comes from the realization that Clinton is much more aligned with so-called ”black political agendas” than the ”scary, potentially racist Republicans.” My parents taught me it was important to forgive, but that never, ever meant a forfeiture of punishment. If he did this several years ago, before he was in office and didn’t continue such acts while in power, then that would be different. But he knew the political climate and what his removal would mean to so many people, and that didn’t stop him from acting like a sex-starved idiot.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Issac B., 25, black, recently married <ibailey@thesunnews.com>, Myrtle Beach, S.C.

FURTHER NOTICE 18:
I am not African American. However, the black ministers seem clearly to believe that (1) Clinton has been on their side more than most other presidents, and (2) that Clinton may have sinned but that the Bible teaches forgiveness and compassion. I suggest you take a look at the current bestselling book The Color of Water, in which a white woman raises 12 chilren and has two black husbands (one after the first dies). She notes that the black community was always understanding, forgiving, warm and accepting of her – a troubled woman from an abusive background – but that this was not so among whites.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Fred, 69, white male, married <flap.@mindspring.com>, CT
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THE QUESTION:
R518: If I am pointing out someone, I often use the word “black” to indicate who they are, as opposed to African American. My African-American friends and white friends get mad, but I only say it for accuracy, because the person may b from Ethiopia, or Cuban American, etc. Is this criticism valid?
POSTED NOV. 16, 1998
Craig M., 35, white male <cmorris@loft.org>, Minneapolis, MN

ANSWER 1:
I don’t know why they’d get mad. We are the only ethnic group that seems to change our identification/moniker every decade or so: Colored, Negro, black, African American. Frankly, I don’t care what you call me.
POSTED NOV. 23, 1998
A.A.W., 42, black female <ANABWI@aol.com>, Plantation, FL
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THE QUESTION:
R517: I’m doing research on female race relations and am coming across many weird stereotypes, such as “black women and Latina women get along, but black women and Latina women do not get along with Asian women,” etc. Is this true? Why would members of one racial minority form ties with or ostracize another? I thought white women were viewed as the common enemy…
POSTED NOV. 13, 1998
Sarah W. 20 <sveg@eden.rutgers.edu>, New Brunswick, NJ

ANSWER 1:
You don’t mention your own background, so it’s difficult to know where you’ve gotten these strange perceptions. Whites are not necessarily the enemy of non-whites; racists are, including other non-white ones. Often non-whites of different groups feel a bond because of similar experiences in dealing with racism. But there is a great deal of racism between non-whites, often due to historical economic competition or cultural differences. Often the antagonism is encouraged by white racists. In my experience, most Latino prejudice is directed against American Indians and blacks, including by some Latinos who have black and Indian ancestry. Most Asian prejudice is directed against blacks or other Asians, especially Japanese v. non-Japanese. Only in the black community do you find most prejudice directed at whites. The reasons are far too complex to state here. A good book to help you understand is Ronald Takaki’s A Different Mirror.
POSTED NOV. 16, 1998
A.C.C., Mexican and American Indian <bigi__@yahoo.com>, San Antonio, TX
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THE QUESTION:
R516: It seems that after I tell men of other races that I am Filipino, there is a sparkle in their eyes. I would like to understand why there is this Asian woman fetish.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
Marcia G., Filipino female <PrincessMarcia@juno.com>, Oceanside, CA

ANSWER 1:
I think some men in the United States are stuck on stereotypes of Asian women as exotic, submissive, and dare I say it, “good in bed.” Again, I strongly remind everyone that these are only stereotypes. Asians have only been in the United States in large numbers for less than 40 years, and many non-Asians in America have not been able to really know a signficant number of Asians to get past the stereotypes. Now, I’m not quite sure where these stereotypes originated. The “submissive” stereotype probably comes from an outdated notion of traditional Asian culture, where women were indeed at least expected to be submissive. However, this was true of many cultures, not just Asian ones. It all goes back to “judging a book by its cover” rather than getting to know people as unique individuals.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Mihir, Indian, 25 <mishah@vt.edu>, Skokie, IL
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THE QUESTION:
R515: Are there cultural reasons that contribute to the higher incidence of HIV among the black community?
POSTED NOV. 10, 1998
Eileen H.-S., 45, white female, San Diego, CA
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THE QUESTION:
R514: What do Americans honestly think of the overflow of immigrants coming into the United States? I am a Filipino immigrant and am consistently told Americans are grateful to have us work and live in their country, but I always say, “Give me a break!” So let’s set the record straight: If you are an American (of any race), what do you think of us immigrants? Do you think we are a “help” or a “threat”?
POSTED NOV. 10, 1998
Jaime T., 21, Filipino-American immigrant, Temecula, CA

ANSWER 1:
I don’t resent immigrants or their descendants in spite of all that has happened in our history. I am certainly very grateful for my wife, who is a Filipina immigrant. I think you are inaccurate in saying there is an “overflow” of immigrants. Immigration has been going down for half a decade and is less proportionately than it was in any time since the turn of the century. I know there are many who feel differently, but I am glad immigrant-bashing was so soundly repudiated in the recent election.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
A.C.C., Mexican and American Indian, San Antonio, TX

FURTHER NOTICE:
One of the things that makes America great is that we constantly have new people with new ideas coming into the country and changing what it means to be American. Most of us are either immigrants or the descendants of immigrants. In spite of certain gripers and xenophobes, I feel that most of us are happy immigration continues. It is a national tradition.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
Colette, 33 <inkwolf@earthlink.net>, Seymour, WI

FURTHER NOTICE 2:
I have absolutely no problem with legal immigrants coming into the country. How could I, since both sides of my family started in this country as immigrants? But I do think that illegal immigration is a very large problem. Americans expect their taxes to be spent on the issues of U.S. citizens, and find the concept of paying out social services to non-U.S. citizens as being rather unfair. After all, if illegal immigration is allowed, so why bother having immigration laws at all? I believe most people who speak out against immigrants are referring to the illegal kind, and that distinction has been lost somewhere along the way.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
John K., straight Irish-American male, 25 <the-macs@geocities.com>, Cranford, NJ

FURTHER NOTICE 3:
I had to think long and hard before answering this question. Until recently I would have answered by saying “This country was built on the backs of slaves and immigrants, so more power to the immigrants.” However, the events of the past few months have made me reconsider my opinion. My partner immigrated to this country to be with me. Unfortunately we’re gay, so we could not get married, so it’s been a very complicated procedure. During the last few months I’ve learned a lot about the immigration policy of this country. I was appalled to learn about the immigration lottery, which allows a predetermined number of people to enter the country each year (however, the vast majority of these are Irish because the law was written by Sen. Edward Kennedy). I’ve also learned that a college-educated professional from Germany who speaks five languages and doesn’t have relatives in this country will have a more difficult time immigrating here than say a high school dropout who only speaks Mandarin or Cantonese who has relatives in this country. I think this process is wrong. Having family in the country shouldn’t have more weight than a person’s ability to become a productive member of society.

I’ve also learned that recent immigrants are afforded more opportunity than people who were born and raised here. There are business loans and other types of government assistance available to immigrants that are unavailable to U.S. citizens. Too many times these immigrants open businesses in poor neighborhoods and because of the aforementioned INS policy regarding family members, they bring their relatives here to work in the business. Situations like this create resentment and distrust. To sum it up, I think the U.S. immigration policy should be revisited. I also think that until the U.S. unemployment rate is considerably lower, all immigration, with the exception of marriage/relationship-related cases, should be halted. The money spent on immigration issues would be better spent addressing education of inner-city school children, unemployment in Appalachia, teen drug abuse, breast cancer, red-lining, homelessness, spousal abuse, etc.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
Tony W., 36 gay black male <tonyway@yahoo.com> San Francisco, CA

FURTHER NOTICE 4:
I think new immigrants are neither a help nor threat, but that’s more a statement about my life than anything else. For society in general, I think immigrants in the long run can only help – new energy, new perspectives and new people wanting to make it here. It pays to remember that except for American Indians, all Americans are descended from immigrants.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
Andrew, 34, fourth-generation American <ziptron@start.com.au>, Huntington, NY

FURTHER NOTICE 5:
I think immigrants are just fine. My family immigrated here in 1906 and became U.S. citizens. A good friend of mine came to this country when he was eight, and his family became citizens. In my opinion, the important thing is that immigrants make the effort to become citizens to go from green card to Social Security card – which I have seen friends and co-workers do. I think many of the expressed problems with immigrants have more to do with the illegal status of some of them than anything else. This country would not be as unique and wonderful as it is without immigrants (all these generations wouldn’t be coming to America if there weren’t something desirable about living here). The irony of immigrants becoming citizens, however, is that the naturalized immigrants often learn and know more about American history, the laws, and the Constitution than the average natural-born American.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
Stephen S., 31, third-generation America, San Antonio, TX

FURTHER NOTICE 6:
Tony, in my own experience with my wife, immigrants do not get any special help. They get much less than the native-born, no food stamps, welfare, special loans, etc. The only exception to this is college grants, which they get the same as citizens. Immigrants usually start small businesses by pooling the money from all extended family members, something minorities here should try doing more. The businesses are started in poor neighborhoods because no one else wants to do business there. I have heard sometimes they treat the neighborhood people badly by overcharging, etc., and I don’t think that’s right, either. But that couldn’t happen if local minorities started their own businesses, too.
POSTED NOV. 13, 1998
A.C.C., Mexican and American Indian, San Antonio, TX
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THE QUESTION:
R513: I am a Hispanic-American female who appreciates the company of men from different ethnic backgrounds. I do not look all Mexican, nor all white. Some people think I am even mixed because of my features: Full lips, very curly hair, and I guess even my outspoken attitude. I will date any ethnicity if I like the person and am genuinely interested in him. My question is, since I tend to attract black males more than any other ethnic group, do white men generally find the attributes I mentioned unattractive? Or do they simply get turned away by thinking someone will only date “black men”?
POSTED NOV. 9, 1998
Gabriella, 23 <rumps002@csusm.edu>, Encinitas, CA
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THE QUESTION:
R512: I’ve noticed that some rich white people call poor white people “poor white trash,” and seem to condemn them for being poor. They also treat them really bad. Why is this?
POSTED NOV. 9, 1998
Whitney T., 19, black female <scrumpies@juno.com>, Oxford, MS

ANSWER 1:
I have used the term “White Trash.” To me it means white people who are poor, possibly on welfare and who have no intention of getting off welfare. They also seem to have been on welfare for several generations. I’ve also heard others use the term referring to those individuals who may embarrass them, like something you would see on aJerry Springer episode (i.e. “I’m sleeping with my sister!”). Those people are also referred to as White Trash. I think they treat the white trashers badly because of the lack of effort (or appearance thereof) to improve one’s lifestyle. As an aside, I would like to comment on an article I found in a news magazine about poverty levels in America. There was a white poverty level and black poverty level. The last time I checked, my family was below the black poverty level, though for where I live we are about average. I guess we are all white trash to city folk?
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
Scott C., 28, married, white <smcolson@key-net.net>, Mt. Jewett, PA

FURTHER NOTICE:
I think it has more to do with the attitudes and actions of the people in question than their financial situation. My understanding of the term is that it describes people who are generally loose with their morals, irresponsible and unkempt, for lack of a better term. There are members of my family who are financially stable but have been called “white trash” for acting in that manner.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
John K., straight Irish-American male, 25 <the-macs@geocities.com>, Cranford, NJ

FURTHER NOTICE 2:
Contrary to what many non-whites may think, we aren’t all alike. To whites, there is a big difference between “white trash” and high-class. Just as many blacks feel that all whites see them as looking alike, I sometimes think blacks think all whites look alike. Basically it comes down to money, and acting like you have money or education. The blacks who are accused of “acting white” or selling out are not really acting white; they’re acting rich. Us rednecks and hillbillies don’t put on airs like that. And, for that matter, most of us hillbillies actually get along better with poor blacks than rich blacks do.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
B., 23, white male, Kokomo, IN

FURTHER NOTICE 3:
I’ve never really heard the expression “poor” white trash as it pertains to income specifically. However, the term “white trash” is certainly prevalent among white people, but I really do not believe it refers to economic status as much as to a certain group of behaviors. Someone who is considered “white trash” might do things like not take good care of themselves and their families, become absorbed in partying and pleasure more than work and self-improvement, and generally show a lack of respect for themselves and those around them. This type of behavior is certainly not limited to poor people. White usage of this expression is similar to black usage of “nigger” when referring to other black people in the community that bring shame to it.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
D.M.M., white female, 24 <donikam@hotmail.com>, Charleston, SC

FURTHER NOTICE 4:
Middle/upper-class whites have more in common with middle/upper-class blacks than with lower-class whites. Upper-class people tend to define themselves in material terms – large house, fancy cars – and often reinforce that by disparaging those without money. Thus, wisecracks about trailer parks and white trash. There is also a fear factor. In upscale communities, everybody is kept in line because they have a lot to lose. People without much to lose are perceived as playing by different rules, or outside the rules, which is scary.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
Bruce H., white, upscale suburbanite <halehart@aol.com>, Hartford, CT

FURTHER NOTICE 5:
I believe that in today’s “politically correct” world, white people often experience great pressure when talking to people of other races. I believe that by degrading members of their own race, some whites feel as if they are appealing to whoever it is they are talking to. Personally, I am extremely offended when somebody of any race uses the term “white trash,” and I never hesitate to tell them.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
Age 23, Caucasian, CA

FURTHER NOTICE 6:
I’ve heard the insults “white trash” and “trailer trash” used occasionally, but I can’t recall ever hearing “poor white trash.” (Maybe “poor” is inherent in “trailer.”) Perhaps the most public example was James Carville’s description of Paula Jones. In any case, I have always understood it to mean an individual who has no self-respect, sense of propriety or common decency (e.g. Jerry Springer guests). Personally, I can’t think of something a whole lot trashier than condemning someone for being poor (or white, for that matter). So to answer your question, I’m not sure that people who use that particular phrase are looking down on others for being poor, but whether they are or not, they may be saying more about themselves than the people they are intending to insult.
POSTED NOV. 12, 1998
Mark, white, middle class, Alexandria, VA

FURTHER NOTICE 7:
Middle-class white people live in morbid fear of falling into the lower ranks, or of being identified with the lower ranks of “undesirables.” Ways of not being white trash are drilled into children, including: Refined conduct and dress (prohibitions against being loud, or wearing worn or overly casual clothing in public, or having tattoos), and keeping the yard and house looking spiffy. White trash does not mean lower class or poor. It means a lack of couth, or decency, or culture. “White trash” really means “uncultured.” It is a put-down. “Poor white trash” describes a white trash person who is also poor, but the main put-down part of that term is still the “white trash” part, not the “poor” part.
POSTED NOV. 13, 1998
Mark S., 30, white, middle class <markseely@aol.com>, Houston, TX

FURTHER NOTICE 8:
One of the most subtle yet pervasive forms of prejudice and discrimination is classism. This goes beyond mere financial status or material wealth. It intertwines with culture, blood lines and geography. This is why there are debates over “blue-blooded old money” vs. “uppity nouveau riche.” But certainly differences in material “success” is the biggest factor in classism. Nor is this a “white” phenomenon. As an Indian American, I occasionally see classism among immigrants from India in the United States, where sometimes doctors, lawyers, engineers and entreprenuers who came in the late ’60s and early ’70s will look down upon or even mistreat those who came in the ’80s and ’90s, who are often less-educated and tend to be cab drivers, domestic workers, factory laborers and small-time shopkeepers.
POSTED NOV. 19, 1998
Mihir, Indian, 25 <mishah@vt.edu>, Skokie, IL
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THE QUESTION:
R511: I recently saw part of a truly awful movie on HBO that involved a “boot camp” for juvenile offenders. One character, an African-American guard, lectured an inmate, also an African American, about his lack of character. In doing so, he distinguished between “niggers” and “blacks,” stating that “niggers” are the gang-bangers and dope addicts, while “blacks” are the hard-working, law-abiding citizens. Do African Americans commonly make this distinction within the African-American community?
POSTED NOV. 9, 1998
Jerry, 65, white male, Tampa , FL

ANSWER 1:
Yes, black people do distingish between the two. Haven’t you heard Chis Rock’s standup routine about “I love black people, can’t stand niggers!” There is a difference: Black people care about the neighborhood, niggers don’t. In effect, niggers are the ones looting, stealing and just plane trifling. They don’t care about nothing, and people who do that are considered niggers.
POSTED NOV. 13, 1998
Gerald <g-battle@nwu.edu>, Chicago, IL

FURTHER NOTICE:
I saw the movie and recall the reference. Movies, particularly those about “black life,” are designed to convey messages or ideas, or to persuade or validate thought. The comment that you referred to was intended to motivate the young, troubled man to correct his steps in life. In layman’s terms, the kid was being advised to take a critical look at his life, to change his ways, and to, as a young black man, develop a sense of personal pride and dignity. The older character was simply using a euphemism to illustrate his point. Television and media sensationalism seldom capture fully the true attitudes and values of “all” black folk. However, what it does do well is market the ongoing myth that there is one vein of black ideology of which all of us buy into. The reality is that the majority of black people have high values, standards, moral and ethical principles, and a positive vision for our children. The advice of parents and loved ones is not usually as harsh as the comments made in the movie, but most of us are familiar with being advised by an older black person(s) to “do right” or to “keep on keepin’ on”. A sense of racial pride and a positive self-identity is important to raising emotionally intact black children (if we don’t tell them they are good and valuable, certainly no one else will). However, most people do not go around challenging our children to view themselves purely in a racial context. So, the “nigger is…” and “black is…” reference in the movie reflected the author’s creative control – his/her personal opinion, ideas, values, or experience. Some of us may agree with the comment, while others may not.
POSTED NOV. 16, 1998
Dee W., black female <westde@hiram.edu>, Cleveland, OH
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