Dare To Ask Talk And News About Our Differences - This topic has 32 replies, 31 voices, and was last updated 19 years, 8 months ago by
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To ACC: What does anything that is written in ‘The Meaning of Macho’ have to do with the Anglo culture’s perception that it’s wrong when men make lewd, sexual remarks at women walking down the street? Even if the book brilliantly contrasts how Anglo women differ from Latin women, what does this have to do with how Anglo women wish to be treated, and why can’t Anglo women be treated the way Anglo women want to be treated? Why can’t men respect the fact that Anglo women don’t want to be catcalled? Muslim women come to the United States and Canada and wish to wear head scarfs. Should we ask them to take those head scarfs off simply because Western men prefer women who don’t wear head scarfs? Muslim women feel uncomfortable without their head scarfs. Should we force them to feel uncomfortable without their scarfs simply because this makes Western men happy? Latin men enjoy giving catcalls, but catcalls make Anglo women uncomfortable. Should we force Anglo women to accept catcalls simply because catcalling women makes Latin men happy? You say Latin culture has ‘a far healthier attitude’. What does this have to do with Katie complaining about Latin men making lewd, sexual remarks? Does the fact that Latin culture has a healthier attitude somehow condone the fact that these men are making lewd, sexual, comments? And what is it you are suggesting when you say Latin women have ‘healthier attitudes’? Are you suggesting that if Katie were more Latin, she could handle those lewd, sexual, inappropriate comments? In other words, you’re saying let’s not blame the grown men making these lewd, inappropriate remarks, let’s blame Anglo women for not being Latin enough.
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Name : Donald, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Christian, Age : 26, City : Toronto, Ontario, State : NA, Country : Canada, Social class : Upper middle class,I wonder if people like ACC would react the same way if it were aggressive gay males standing at street corners shouting out such ‘gems’ at other latino men. I suspect they would either beat them up or run for the hills. This is by far the strangest apology for sexism I have heard so far.
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Name : N-Mohan, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Gay, Race : Asian, Religion : Atheist, Age : 30, City : Paris, State : NA, Country : France, Occupation : Student, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,MEN are ‘sexist’. Whistles and catcalls are not exclusive to Latino men. And while I don’t condone this behavior, perhaps if women carried themselves better, they would not get negative attention. If you dress like a hooker, you’re likely to be treated like a hooker, even if you are not one. It is unrealistic to expect that men won’t respond to you in a certain way, if you dress in a certain way. Ladies, if you don’t want Latino or other ethnicities of men to disrespect you, put some clothes on. And notice the difference in the way you are treated. You cannot walk the streets with your asses hanging out and get mad when a man comments. You don’t want the comments, cover your ass up.
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Name : Rhonda-P-Outlaw30010, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : Black/African American, Religion : Lutheran, Age : 42, City : Laurelton, State : NY, Country : United States, Occupation : Account Representative, Education level : 2 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,Hi Katie, I live in a mostly Hispanic neighborhood and it’s not that bad here. I find that some guys do harrass, and others are very respectful toward women. Gang members (probably the people who are bothering you) tend to hang out in groups and try to show what big men they are by putting down women. A couple of 40s will add to their courage. You and some other people in your neighborhood should complain to the police and also tell the grocery stores that you’ll get them shut down if they don’t disperse these creeps. It really worked in my neighborhood. Latin men tend to be more flirtacious than white men, but there’s a big difference between ‘your eyes are like dawn,’ and ‘can I lick your p****?’
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Name : Marie22260, City : Chicago, State : IL, Country : United States,I like women because I’m a man, not because I’m Mexican. Race has nothing to do with it. Also, maybe a lot, you probably mistake simple ‘catcalls’ for sexism. There is a huge difference. If a guy (any race) walks up to you and says for example- ‘Damn, your fine’ or whatever, that’s not being sexist. If anything that sounds like a compliment, you just probably take it the wrong way. Now, if he walks up to you and starts caressing your breast, THEN it becomes sexist. Or if he says ‘Hey there,girl’, nothing is really wrong with that. But if he says ‘Hey b**ch!’, then you can call that sexism. Maybe you take this ignorant stereotype to be true because your not aquainted with many Hispanic people. I bet if you met an upper class, Latino gentlemen who treated you with complete dignity & respect, you would have never posted this message.
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Name : Nick, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : Hispanic/Latino (may be any race), City : Dallas, State : TX, Country : United States, Social class : Lower middle class,Let me start off by saying that the original message posted, I feel, was not racist in any way. The question was not suggesting that Latin people are racist, she was asking what others view on the subject might be. Also, I would like to say that IT IS NOT RIGHT TO BE SEXUALLY HARASSED BY ANYONE, reguardless of race. There are laws about that stuff, and yes, all kinds of guys often break the laws by the things they say. I attend a high school that is about 50% minorities. I am not blind to the stereotypes that are present. I’ve been a victim of sexual comments as well. No, it doesn’t scare me, it disgusts me. I found it funny how the people accusing others of being racist were actually the only ones talking about racism in their message. The truth is, it’s hard to grasp the idea of being a part of another race because we obviously cannot experience that. I will never see other ethnic viewpoints because I cannot change my ethnicity. There is just too much curiosity and confusion. So before you jump on me for being racist, just stop and wonder what you might think if you were in my shoes.
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Name : Jana, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Christian, Age : 18, City : Maple Grove, State : MN, Country : United States, Education level : Less than High School Diploma, Social class : Upper middle class,They treat all women like they treat their mothers!
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Name : therocdoc24749, City : aurora, State : CO, Country : United States,ok i just spent a week in charge of a red cross shelter here in hurricane blasted florida and the first answer here just cleared something up for me. i am anglo all 125 people living in the shelter were latino alot of them single male field workers and they were so co-operative with me had no problem with me being in charge altho they found my ‘resturant spanish’ hilarious.i was a little suprised by thier helpful attitudes but now i get it. the shelter was our ‘home’ and they are used to a strong female being in charge of the home if what you are saying is correct and based on my experiance it is. p.s. in NO WAY did i ever feel threatened or uncomfertable around all these guys who i could barely communicate with.they were always VERY respectful!
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Name : lucy, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Age : 40, City : bradenton, State : FL, Country : United States, Occupation : waitress, Education level : High School Diploma, Social class : Lower middle class,‘one Anglo after another spouts the same line of ‘It-can’t-be, no-way, it’s-just-gotta-be true, whites really are more enlightened than those piggish brown people!’ ‘yet all you can do is turn around and bash Latinos and delude yourself into thinking you’re superior.’ And you’re proving Hispanics are more enlightened by saying that all the White people making comments you disagree with are being racist? From my personal experience, what they’re saying is wrong, but when you twist their comments around and say they’re being racist when they’re just giving their opinion, YOU’RE the one who’s deluding yourself into thinking you’re superior.
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Name : I-Hate-Hypocrites, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Baptist, City : lkj, State : CA, Country : United States, Social class : Middle class,Maybe that crap works just fine in your homeland latino culture and nobody is offended. The truth is that you are an ugly foreigner and extremly out of place in U.S. culture. If you did cat calls at my daughter I’d want to cut your balls off and stick them in your arrogant mouth.
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Name : PM, City : Houston, State : TX, Country : United States,I am an anglo woman and have recieved vulgar remarks from latinos as I was passing by them. But, I do not feel that these vulgar remarks are limited to the latino race. But I will say, if you felt that racist remarks was being said here about latino men, you responded but racist remarks about anglo women. So you are just as much a racist. I do have to say, If you feel that Cuba has made more progress in womans rights, why are you here. You are obviously not happy here with the limitations, you perceive are placed on women here. I personally have seen many Latino women, who are very subservant to their men, and I personally see no problem with this, a woman being dedicated to her man. Why are you ashamed to admit to this. Oh well, I have said my piece I am sure many will disagree with what I have written.
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Name : Donna, City : Wrightwood, State : CA, Country : United States,Iwould have hoped that such behavior would have changed by now. I recall that when I was a girl I encountered the same situation. I feel that most of the remarks came from lower class Hispanics & anglos & I hated the attention. I just cringed & was not at all flattered. I just held my breath & passed these jerks as I went about my business.
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Name : Mona22572, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : Hispanic/Latino (may be any race), Religion : Catholic, Age : 73, City : Pittsburg, State : CA, Country : United States, Education level : High School Diploma, Social class : Upper middle class,My wife was harrased in the same way when she was a girl living on the lower east side of Manhattan in New York City back in the late ’50s early ’60s. She was all of 10 years old and she said that this was something she had to endure every day when she walked back and forth to school. She hated it and to this day has a low opinion of these types. It’s a shame it is being defended in this thread.
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Name : Larry22958, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Age : 55, City : Amarillo, State : TX, Country : United States, Education level : 2 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,Catcalling, based on my exposure to Latin culture, is not traditionally meant to be vulgar. If you visit the Caribbean in particular, it’s not uncommon for men and women to toss compliments to members of the opposite sex. Many times it’s not meant to be even sexual or an invitation. It tends to be a unique cultural exchange and affirmation of physical beauty. Anglo culture by comparison tends to be very reserved and rigid. How many Anglos casually address perfect strangers of a different background (socio-economic, racial, religion, etc.)? Latin culture values physical beauty, especially those of women. Also, many Latinas are encouraged to be more conscious of their bodies and sexuality. So catcalling that is not vulgar isn’t perceived as being threatening or offensive. Dispute this assertion? Look at the statistics comparing Latinas to Anglo women in positive self-image and significantly lower rates of anorexia, and differences in satisfaction with respect to intimate relations. This is not meant to excuse the “gentlemen” who bombard you with insults. In the modern-day case of Latin catcalling, it’s not meant to control women or even sexualize them. What you are experiencing is possibly unemployed poor men who feel disempowered by their exclusion from the American mainstream, asserting their only tool of empowerment (think phallic). Being a white woman represents a token in Latin culture. Middle-class and educated – you symbolize a sort of out-of-reach object, not necessarily sexual, but more in status. So the catcalling is expressed in a distorted version of a pretty common Latin form of expression.
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Name : V, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : Black/African American, Religion : Baptist, Age : 27, City : Philadelphia, State : PA, Country : United States, Occupation : IT Consulting, Education level : 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,Does cultures can influence in sexism? Of course yes, cultures has an influence on everything. Can you say from that that Latino culture is more sexist? No. Because first of all, using the term Latino culture implies the homogeneization of a huge variety of cultures and subcultures -and other dynamic factors that impact in the individual behaviour; and second, culture is different from race. I am glad you brought up this topic because I am doing a research (well, I am on the exploratory stage) on Street harassment here in Lima that I am planning to convert in my final thesis. I thought of this topic when I discovered a web group where girls from all over Peru use to discuss how they hate men harassing them in the street. What I have found so far from all the readings and web searching in spanish, english and french, is that women from different places/countries/regions tend to identify the most frequent agressor. Here in Perú it is ‘los cholos’, (a despective term for native people who move to the cities) and while in London, several girls complained about black men, here for instance where there are also black men, they tend to be the ones who harass the less (I am harassed since I am 12 and I cant recall a black man between the agressors). In general, here they tend to be stereotyped as humble and respectful. Of course, you can not generalize my opinion for all the rest of my country because I am talking from my experience as a middle class girl who lives in the metropolitan area of the capital city. As I said, I am still in the beginning, but for now I hope I gave you a bit of an answer.
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Name : Claudia Cáceres, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Age : 25, City : Lima, State : NA, Country : Peru, Occupation : Sociologist/ Designer, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,
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