Dare To Ask Talk And News About Our Differences - This topic has 46 replies, 45 voices, and was last updated 14 years ago by
.
- Posts
- Careful studies indicate there is a huge gap in intelligence between sub-Saharan Africans and Europeans (25 or so IQ points on average), with Europeans being smarter, and a small gap between Europeans and Northeast Asians (about 2 IQ points on average), with Northeast Asians being smarter. But when differences, especially differences that cast whites in a favorable light, are mentioned, whites panic and act guilty for being the beneficiaries of thousands of years of evolutiuon. I consider myself a proud white man, but I am also objective. Northeast Asians are slightly smarter than us, but it is very likely that the 100 or so smartest men ever to live were/are white (basically there are a few really smart whites, lots of smart whites, lots of whites of mediocre intelligence and lots of really stupid whites, such that the white average IQ comes in just lower than the Northeast Asian average IQ, even though the smartest men ever to live were probably white). The irony is that non-whites seem very open to talk about these racial differences. Some blacks acknowledge that their race is on average less intelligent than the white race (there are of course black supremacist loonies who think the ancient Egyptians were black, and thus that blacks are the master race). Why are white people so much more susceptible to political correctness?
User Detail :
Name : Von B., Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Agnostic, Age : 24, City : Madison, State : WI Country : United States, Occupation : Research Assistant, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Upper middle class,I think you have to take into consideration who produced these 'careful studies.' If they are created by white Westerners who have come up with IQ tests based on their knowledge and ideas of intellect, then I think the process of evaluating intellect through IQ tests imposes 'white' understandings and acceptances of what defines intelligence on other societies. Maybe these studies take this into consideration, but I thought I'd raise the point, anyway.User Detail :
Name : K.B., Gender : F, City : Edin, State : NA Country : United Kingdom,It sounds as though you're looking for a fight, but I'll answer anyway. Throughout history, whites (and any other conquering race) have used supposed intellectual differences as the prime explanation for their deeds. White people are the most guilty over their history. Many other countries do not even teach the darker sides of their history, while American history focuses intensely on the missteps. Hence, whites are very ashamed of their history and do not want much of a connection to it. Examing possible differences in average intelligence feels like familiar territory in this regard.User Detail :
Name : Seamus28215, Gender : M, Age : 23, City : Charlestown, State : MA Country : United States, Occupation : Construction, Social class : Lower class,Where exactly did you compile this information concerning the issue of I.Q.? I was never aware that one's intellect had anything to do with race/or origin of descent. Your proof (or lack thereof) sounds very contradictory if evolution played a part in distributing intellectual prowess to one particular racial or ethnic group. I believe that it has everything to do with the societal distortions and discrepancies that were placed on those groups long ago,thanks in part to the historians and the media. I also find it interesting that you call to attention 'the black supremacist loonies who think the ancient egyptians were black and thus that blacks were the smarter race' (you are aware that Egypt is in the same vicinity as that of Africa, being in the same region, but who's to say they were black?). My memory serves me correctly that the Nazis had an even more radical approach, to go as far as to annihilate anyone who did not have blond hair/blue eyes (ironically Hitler's physical features did not comprise of these characteristics). Which finally proves that I.Q. is very non sequitur in your argument toward race, and might I add, highly irrelevent toward one's ethnicity.User Detail :
Name : A.H., Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : Black/African American, Religion : Christian, Age : 22, City : Fort Wayne, State : IN Country : United States, Education level : 4 Years of College,Two points: 1) Who is white and who is not? I bet you will fail to classify half of my town! How do you you classify Latinos, or Eurasians, or half-Congolese half-Japanese people? I would like to know how people managed to sample people based on race for an IQ test. Is that even possible? Are you talking about race or geography? 2) What's an IQ test? What does it measure? It measures your ability to know whether the next drawing is a square inside a circle or a circle inside a square. Big deal. Sure, Europeans have invented a lot of nice stuff, but they also discovered such niceties as smog, global warming, the nuke, bio weapons, Auschwitz, etc. And that brings us to Sub-Saharan Africa. I haven't heard mother nature complaining about the bushmen of South Africa. People are not automatically stupid just because they know how to live in balance with nature. I would like someone to dig out this statistic: How many species were made extinct by white folk, and how many by black Africans (you can win this one with Australia alone).User Detail :
Name : Karim, Gender : M, Age : 23, City : Los Angeles, State : CA Country : United States, Social class : Middle class,How do you know that most whites ignore these differences? Maybe it's just not as important to others as it is to you. I feel that you should get a life and stop worrying about other ethnicities. Obviously, you are envious of other ethnicites; that's why you notice these differences.User Detail :
Name : MarronBella22148, Gender : F, Race : Black/African American, Age : 24, City : Anniston, State : AL Country : United States, Occupation : Customer Service, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Lower class,I'm not sure what your point is. I'm not aware of any testing that 'proves' that any race is smarter than another. There are definitely cultural differences in the value and pursuit of education, such as Asian and European (esp. Jewish) culture, which place greater emphasis on education than African American and Hispanic cultures - but this doesn't mean anyone is any more or less intelligent. Rather, they score higher on IQ tests or SATs as a result of hard work and focus.User Detail :
Name : Jay31306, Gender : F, Race : White/Caucasian, City : New York, State : NY Country : United States, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,Intelligence tests usually work on a cultural basis. If you can truly factor that out, I don't think one race is more intelligent than another. Having said that, unless you have asked millions of people your question, you have yourself made a racist remark. Canadian, American, Russian, French, British, Spanish and Ukrainian are just a smattering of people you need to talk to before making any conclusions.User Detail :
Name : Ronald-V29452, Gender : M, City : Edmonton, Alberta, State : NA Country : Canada,Well, I'm not sure even where to begin, but I'll begin by asking: who do you think wrote these intelligence tests in the first place? I would not put much stock in IQ testing, because it's pretty much impossible to engineer a culture-neutral test, let alone one that compensates for factors such as language, social standing, etc. If you're testing two white guys from the same neighborhood, okay maybe the results are comparable. Maybe. But how could you possibly create an unbiased test that would fairly evaluate a white guy from, say, New England and a black guy from Morocco? The universe contained within these intelligence tests is a pretty narrow and artificial one, and I would argue that this universe is deeply culturally biased, unintentionally, by the person devising the test. For example, one of the things these tests attempt to quantify is one's ability to abstractly analyze spatial relationships. I actually test very highly in this regard, yet I'm really terrible at tasks which you'd think this skill is necessary, such as carpentry. But it's easy to envision a blue-collar intelligence measurement which requires basic carpentry skills, and by those standards I'm probably not a very smart guy. So which 'test' is more accurate? The burly blue-collar guy would say that since even after I measure the wood three times I still cut it to the wrong length, I mustn't be very smart with spacial relationships. And within the universe of his test, he's probably right. Perhaps this isn't quite the best analogy, but the point I'm trying to make is that these tests really don't map well into the real world as many people would lead you to believe. Regarding your last point: I try not to assume that everyone else in the world is a white male American. Does that make me politically correct?User Detail :
Name : Dave25983, Gender : M, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Agnostic, Age : 38, City : San Diego, State : CA Country : United States, Occupation : Engineer, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Upper middle class,IQ tests are a pretty flawed way of testing IQ. Tests show the average IQ of an American has risen over the past century, far too brief a time for evolution to have any effect. Even the 'thousands of years' you quote is a blip as far as our genes are concerned. More likely is that IQ tests are affected by education. Someone brought up in the West is also more likely to do well. Most of what you write is unsubstantiated supposition. 'It is very likely that the 100 or so smartest men ever to live were/are white.' Where on earth did you get that from? And no smart white women then, eh? I'm not sure you're quite as objective as you think you are.User Detail :
Name : Andrew R., Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Atheist, Age : 27, City : Wolverhampton, State : NA Country : United Kingdom, Occupation : Student, Social class : Middle class,I couldn't get all points out in my first post, so here's da rest:By your reasoning, a South African pure-blooded black male who is a genius would be the ultimate superior individual because he has the intellectual ability of a white man and the physical strength and sexual dominance of a black man. What would you do then? But no one is superior to anyone else, because one trait, talent or ability does not make one better or more worthy to exist than another. There are dumb whites and unathletic blacks. There are endowed whites and average blacks. There are white women with booty for miles and black girls with NOASSATAW.
I wish the people writing into these forums would not phrase their comments in terms of absolutes and make sorry attempts to conceal their biases and agendas. Questions about why white women have no lips and flat butts are not real questions - they are opinions and not-so-sly disses that suggest where the author may be coming from. As more and more blood is mixed, the monopolies each race claims to have on certain traits and attributes are going to disappear. So we need to move away from that archaic thinking. And the Egyptians were black, but that doesn't mean blacks are the master race.
User Detail :
Name : Michael F., Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : Black/African American, Religion : Baptist, Age : 25, City : Chicago, State : IL Country : United States, Occupation : unemployed, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,Bushmen suffer routine abuse by more 'settled' black groups in Africa. Just thought I would drop my dime in there. However, the orginal poster does raise cultural questions, like:Why can some groups, even in oppressed areas, succeed economically? Such as the Chinese in Indonesia and Malaysia (not oppressed here anymore) or Jews around the world? Or overseas Indians dominating the economies in Trinidad, Fiji, and parts of East Africa?
Surely there are lessons these groups provide; it's just a fact that some cultures (I'm not talking exclusively about race here) are better at educational/economic success than others.
User Detail :
Name : Jon27105, Gender : M, Race : Hapa, City : Seattle, State : WA Country : United States, Social class : Upper class,It sounds to me like you are not as objective as you claim to be in making the assertions you are making, especially about something as expansively defined as intelligence. You suggest that whites should not be ashamed of an imaginary advantage they possess in intellect based on IQ tests? As if whites are inherently smarter than other races? That's garbage. Then you suggest your 'objectivity' is visible because you're willing to concede that some Asians may be a little smarter? How do you fit in your house with that big head of yours?First of all, intellect is a reflection of what someone learns. There is no 'smart gene.' You don't hear about Joey Einstein's theory of generality, do you? Some of the smartest and brightest people have lived and left this planet unrecognized, and narrowing the measure of true intelligence to the data garnered from the largely flawed IQ test only compounds the controversy.
This is a supremacy/superiority dialogue at its worst, and it sounds to me that you think blacks are flaunting their genetic attributes, so whites should flaunt theirs. The only problem is that intelligence is not a genetic attribute, so whites do not own a monopoly on smarts. Keep in mind that whites invented race and indoctrinated the Western world in the genetic differences between whites in blacks in a racist manner, and that what many blacks brag about today was stated long ago by whites who bought and sold black slaves and enjoyed the intricacies of black sexuality.
User Detail :
Name : Michael F., Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : Black/African American, Religion : Baptist, Age : 25, City : Chicago, State : IL Country : United States, Occupation : unemployed, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,The Egyptians were not black, they were definitely (as almost all Egyptologists assert) North Eastern Hamites (very similar to berebers today). This I guess should not be seen as inferiority of blacks because many subsaharan civilisations were also superior. I think African-American fixation with Egypt and inability to appreciate sub-saharan cultures is a very bad indication of the level of your self esteem.User Detail :
Name : Karim, Gender : M, Age : 23, City : Los Angeles, State : CA Country : United States, Social class : Middle class,Ok von look. lets think about this together. First of all, IQ tests are pish posh. The only purpose an IQ test serves is to show what type of schooling a person has had, their motivation towards learning, and perhaps their economic status. There have been several times the makers of the SATs had to take words out because some american school districts didnt even teach them. I do not believe the 100 smartest people were 'white'. There were civilizations of color that were building empires before there were 'whites'. Furthermore, using the color white to descibe people is about as outdated and unscientific as calling different cultures/ethnicities of people different RACES. There is only one human race. About those blacks who 'acknowledge that their race is on average less intelligent than the white race'. They are as dull as you. Of course they would say that because they ARE the stupid ones! America seems to classify people who are of 'African desent' as black, so seeing as how Egypt is in Africa, it is very possible they could be called black. Besides, i have seen in many a text book Eqyptians being classified as 'white'. Go figure that. Those black supremacists are no more 'loony' then those 'white' ones who say their 'race' is the supreme race...and they arent usually finished ranting without adding a few things you already listed above. What does that say about u? To aknowledge your question: you must be feeling guilty, because I have never heard of such. One could argue that it is lack of guilt which is the problem, and im not talking about past travisties. In conclusion: I hope people from different countries reading this don't think all Americans think like you.User Detail :
Name : Dominique, Gender : F, Age : 20, City : Houston, State : TX Country : United States, Occupation : Scientist, Education level : 2 Years of College, Social class : Lower class,
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.