Innocent civilians – apparent double-standard?

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  • #996

    Jane C.
    Member

    On Sept. 11, thousands of innocent civilians were killed in the United States. But when innocent civilians are being killed in Afghanistan, apparently 94 percent of Americans are in favor of the military action. Americans: Can you explain why it’s OK with you?

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    Name : Jane C., Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Lesbian, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Atheist, Age : 34, City : Edinburgh, State : NA, Country : United Kingdom, Occupation : Writer, Education level : 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 
    #39804

    Heather21464
    Member

    I wanted to clarify that your 94 percent number may be (must be) a little skewed. I’m not sure where you got it, but I have seen polls on CNN.com and other places, and I see very surprising (to me) results as far as the votes go. I wouldn’t trust those numbers, and I don’t. On CNN.com and other places, you do not get a representative sample of the population. You just get a sample of who was on-line that day and felt like voting. Also, I’ve noticed the questions on the news sites are asked occasionally in a manner that puts a value-judgment on the answer, rather than allowing a simple yes or no. So even if I felt that my answer was ‘no,’ the ‘because’ statement doesn’t fit, so I choose ‘yes,’ or something to that effect. There are Americans who are for this retaliation, or whatever you want to call it. There are also many who don’t believe it’s the right solution. There are many angry, scared, confused, grieving people in the United States and in other countries, and I think that causes some knee-jerk reactions to the deaths of so many people in one day. On one hand, I agreed that some sort of immediate reaction by our government was/is necessary. On the other hand, I believe that more understanding of the situation and the consequences by the general population of any military actions is needed before such actions take place. My opinion is that much of the knee-jerk reaction of the desire for retaliation wouldn’t have been so strong had people really stopped to think about the consequences. Hope that helps in your understanding of at least one American’s thoughts on the subject.

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    Name : Heather21464, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Christian, Age : 26, City : Cincinnati, State : OH, Country : United States, Occupation : Engineer, Education level : 4 Years of College, Social class : Upper middle class, 
    #27880

    CC19330
    Member

    There is no double standard. Those who are against military action in Afghanistan are the ones who need their heads examined. We have to speak in ‘their language’ (i.e. violence) for them to understand. Peace negotiation won’t work this time around. I am sick of anti-war protests and sit-ins. This isn’t Vietnam, baby.

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    Name : CC19330, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : Asian, Age : 22, City : Somewhere, State : NA, Country : Canada, Occupation : student, Education level : 4 Years of College, Social class : Upper middle class, 
    #32171

    James D.
    Member

    Many reasons. First, war has been declared against us, and non-combatants get killed during a war. Bin Laden and his troops are the enemy; the Taliban is their puppet government; Afghanistan is their country. Second, we (unlike them) aren’t purposely targeting civilians (in fact, we go out of our way to avoid them). Third, we know one of the typical cowardly actions of these murderous animals who cower underground is to hide military assets among their innocents, both to protect those assets and to propagandize the deaths of those people should the assets be destroyed. Finally, the deaths we cause in Afghanistan are a tiny fraction of the deaths deliberately perpetrated by the Taliban on their own people for “religious transgressions,” and the destruction of the Taliban will save far more innocent lives than it costs. These terrorist cowards are not civilized, they are not acting in a civilized manner and our response to them is far more civilized than they deserve. While we have no animosity toward the poor people of Afghanistan, monstrous, evil people walk among them and must be destroyed.

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    Name : James D., Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Gay, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Atheist, Age : 47, City : Summit, State : NJ, Country : United States, Education level : 4 Years of College, 
    #27301

    J.D.
    Member

    The difference is simple. We are not targeting innocent civilians. U.S. military forces are making every attempt to minimize civilian casualties. The terrorists made no such attempts, and thousands of innocent civilians are now dead. In fact, we are dropping thousands of packages containing food for Afghan civilians who would otherwise starve during the winter. Granted, there are no Arabic instructions on the packages, but then again, the Taliban excludes women from being educated, so many young mothers would not be able to read them, anyway. We send them food, the terrorists send us Anthrax-laden mail. Are you suggesting we allow these attacks to go unanswered? What end would that accomplish?

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    Name : J.D., Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : No organized religion, Age : 34, City : Dallas, State : TX, Country : United States, Occupation : Automotive Technician, Education level : 2 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 
    #35371

    Bill
    Member

    You cannot equate the attack on the United States, in which 5,000 civilians were targeted for death, to an ongoing military mission in which war has been declared to destroy the Taliban and Bin Laden and his clan of terrorists. Our military is not targeting civilians, it is targeting the terrorist network and the government that is protecting them. The U.S. government has repeatedly declared that we are not targeting the Afghan people or Islam. Unfortunately, civilians get killed by accident in war. The Taliban can choose to end all of this by not harboring terrorists and turning over Bin Laden and his clan. I am fully in favor of this, as are the majority of Americans.

    Trust me when I say this is not a tit-for-tat retribution. I had business relationships with four men who are missing and believed dead in the World Trade Center towers. My brother has an office in the Pentagon in Washington but was uninjured. This has touched me personally, yet I am not out for payback on the innocent Afghanis.

    This act of cowardice has brought the United States to war, and we (with the help of our allies) will wipe the terrorists out, whoever and wherever they are, and regardless of the time it takes. There is a lot of hate being directed at us right now in the foreign press and in other media, and yes, this has been a wake-up call for America. We are calling in our chips for all the aid we have provided other countries over the years to help us win this war. Because, guess what? These terrorist scum are targeting people all over the world, not just Americans in the United States. And if Edinburgh gets targeted, you can bet your American friends will be there to help you. Twenty years ago, it would have been myself helping you; today it would be my sons. To quote our president: ‘We will not tire, we will not falter and we will not fail.’

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    Name : Bill, Gender : M, City : n/a, State : NA, Country : United States, 
    #24197

    Allison
    Member

    I can’t speak for all Americans, but I can give you my opinion. In any other circumstance, the 94 percent (which I assume you saw in a poll or survey somewhere) would probably be much lower. I can’t imagine many Americans feeling that it was OK to bomb Afghanistan, possibly killing innocents, just for the heck of it. We didn’t even have a big military reaction the first time they bombed our Trade Center, nor when they blew a big hole in the side of the USS Cole. However, this time they went too far, and we had to do something. Unfortunately, that reaction will cost more innocent lives (ours and theirs). But hopefully, it will save even more lives down the line. So I don’t think the 94 percent are in favor of going over and randomly mowing down Afghan women and children – I think they feel like it’s justified in this situation.

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    Name : Allison, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Lesbian, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Atheist, Age : 36, City : Mission Viejo, State : CA, Country : United States, Occupation : Analyst, Education level : 4 Years of College, 
    #24098

    Doug25617
    Member

    ‘Military Action’ is a vague concept and covers a vast array of possible actions. Had the poll asked ‘Are you in favor of the slaughter of innocents?’ the response would likely have been much much lower. There are those Americans who believe in an eye for an eye. I find myself scoffing at the Taliban spokespeople crying about innocents injured or killed in light of the 6000 innocents killed in New York and Washington. There are also those who believe in ‘acceptable losses’ in military action, a small number of civilian casualties during an attack on a nearby military structure. If you are attempting to argue that violence should not be met with violence, let’s say I punch you in the face. You get up and make your peace and I punch you down again. How many times are you going to argue for peace in light of direct harm done to you before you retaliate?America has long been placed in the position of the world’s peacekeeper: we take crap from other countries when without our protection those countries could easily be invaded. It’s easy to whine about a peacful solution when you are not the responsive party.

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    Name : Doug25617, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Gay, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : New Age/Metaphysical, Age : 38, City : Phoenix, State : AZ, Country : United States, Occupation : Adminstrator, Education level : 2 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 
    #36093

    Alex J.
    Member

    The simple answer is that not all Americans are in favor of these actions. Now the in-depth explanation: Despite our claim of being a democracy, we’re not. The United States is barely a Republic, but is closer to an oligarchy that must respond to public whim. And the current whim is for revenge. If you study the U.S. newspapers, you see that the politicians are focusing on aspects of the ‘war’ that do not reflect the human casualties. The country is being presented a view that we are punishing Afghanistan, when in reality we are doing nothing of the kind. I am disgusted at the actions of my government, but until elections I have no way to affect the situation beyond taking part in a few demonstrations.

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    Name : Alex J., Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Bisexual, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Jewish, Age : 17, City : Elkins Park, State : PA, Country : United States, Occupation : High School student, Education level : Less than High School Diploma, Social class : Middle class, 
    #36726

    Matthew
    Member

    It is the same energy used by those responsible for the Sept. 11 massacre, but from another perspective. All action has a reaction. Now do you see?

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    Name : Matthew, Gender : M, Race : White/Caucasian, Age : 45, City : New York, State : NY, Country : United States, 
    #19544

    Michael20646
    Member

    If the purpose of our military action was to target innocent civilians at random and to inflict ‘terror’ on them, then you would find that 100 percent of Americans would be opposed to that sort of activity. The Taliban – owned and operated by Osama Bin Laden and Al Queda – set out to target and kill innocent civilians on Sept. 11. They succeeded. And now they must suffer the consequences of that immoral behavior.

    Unlike the attack Sept. 11, we gave the Taliban and Afghan people plenty of warning before commencing the targeting of military objectives – warnings and targeting that very well may cost additional American, British and other Allied lives because we seek to minimize civilian casualties. Had we no compunction about the loss of innocent civilians in Afghanistan, they would be laid waste – and no food support would be sent to them, either.

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    Name : Michael20646, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Gay, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Methodist, Age : 40, City : Houston, State : TX, Country : United States, Occupation : Intranet Manager, Education level : 4 Years of College, Social class : Upper middle class, 
    #18323

    I am repeating what I heard on a talk show: When the World Trade Center was bombed, the perpetrators intentionally took innocent lives. The U.S. military is bombing the military targets and is unintentionally killing the innocent. In any war, innocent people are killed. Hiroshima and Nagasaki are examples. There are no winners in a war. Both sides sustain major casualties.

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    Name : Ronald-V29447, Gender : M, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Christian, City : Edmonton, Alberta, State : NA, Country : Canada, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, 
    #44951

    Steve27847
    Member

    I guess since there hasn’t been an innocent massacred in Europe in, say, the last 10 minutes, you can now ask this question of us. The talk in the United States is that we have been too predictable and passive in the past. Inserting the element that we might react with overkill might cause future terrorists to rethink the outcome of their actions. People need to take into their calculations what might happen on the homefront when they blissfully convince some moron to crash a commercial airliner. I am truly sorry that an occasional retaliatory bomb goes astray, but the world needs to know that these are now the rules. Afghan civilians have had a month to plan – far more than the World Trade Center victims were given.

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    Name : Steve27847, Gender : M, Race : White/Caucasian, Age : 45, City : Houston, State : TX, Country : United States, Occupation : Still on The Top Floor of a Skyscraper, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Upper class, 
    #46442

    Summer
    Member

    I can’t speak for every American, but I support our military action in Afghanistan for several reasons. As far as your question about innocent people being killed, this is why it is ‘OK’ with me: Innocent people are killed in every war. America is fighting a war right now, a war on terrorism. When the World Trade Center was bombed, many Afghanis were cheering in the streets. Americans are not cheering. We are scared and deeply saddened by the events of Sept. 11 and everything since. I, as I believe many Americans, never like to see innocent lives taken. Unfortunately, that’s not always possible. Terrorism has to be stopped before it takes more lives.

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    Name : Summer, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Pentecostal, Age : 19, City : David City, State : NE, Country : United States, Occupation : student, Education level : High School Diploma, Social class : Middle class, 
    #17258

    Naomi
    Member

    I am American and agree with you. It is not all Afghanis who are terrorists, just some. Why are we punishing everyone?

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