Dare To Ask Talk And News About Our Differences - This topic has 15 replies, 16 voices, and was last updated 24 years, 2 months ago by
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- Why is it that the police never stop homeless people and ask them about those shopping carts they always seem to be pushing around? They probably didn't buy them, so they're most likely stolen property. Shouldn't they be ticketed and have them confiscated?
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Name : J-Miller, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Atheist, Age : 26, City : Lansing, State : MI Country : United States, Occupation : Network Administrator, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Upper middle class,A police officer has no way of knowing the shopping cart was stolen by the person. It could have easily been picked up from an alley. The officer can confiscate the cart, but it would take a whole day to get that cart back to the owner and wait for a van driver to get the cart off-site. Then the police officer has to file the paper work and attempt to contact the owner. If no owner shows up, the cart sits in storage at taxpayers' expense.User Detail :
Name : Christopher D., Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Christian, Age : 23, City : Arlington, State : TX Country : United States, Education level : High School Diploma, Social class : Lower middle class,The homeless have a tough life and so little to begin with. You say you are upper middle class, so you probably have a comfortable life and don't have to worry about getting your basic needs met. Other people aren't as fortunate as you. If you aren't going to do something to help those less fortunate than you, at least have some compassion for them.User Detail :
Name : Jacqueline-C20983, Gender : F, Race : White/Caucasian, Age : 25, City : San Jose, State : CA Country : United States, Occupation : Engineer, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,In many cities, even supposedly liberal San Francisco, police have a policy of taking away carts from homeless people. But they rarely charge homeless people for 'stealing' the carts. For one thing, a few days in jail with meals and a bed is what many homeless people would prefer to the way they live, especially when it is cold in winter. For another, many working-class people who can't afford to drive a car take those shopping carts also and use them to push their groceries home. But arresting or ticketing people who work would cause a major hassle. It's interesting that this last group would say they are just borrowing the cart. Finally, cops have better things to do, or they should.I have to ask why you would feel concerned about shopping carts, unless you own a store yourself. These are not major criminals we're talking about, but people with nothing. Police hassling the homeless accomplishes nothing and is downright mean-spirited toward the very poor.
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Name : A.C.C., Race : Mexican and American Indian, City : W Lafayette, State : IN Country : United States, Occupation : Grad student, Education level : Over 4 Years of College,Legally, a police officer needs 'probable cause' to detain someone or make an arrest; that is, an officer cannot walk up to someone and 'assume' their property is stolen. There must be a complainant for the officer to make the arrest. If a merchant observed one of his or her shopping carts in someone else's possession and filed a complaint, the officer could take action.User Detail :
Name : Shawn, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Gay, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Episcopalian, Age : 24, City : Fort Worth, State : TX Country : United States, Occupation : Aviation/Military Police, Education level : Technical School, Social class : Lower middle class,Your question highlights the problem with the issue of homelessness in this country - that it is perceived as a choice and is therefore the fault of the homeless person. Even if the homeless person 'stole' the shopping cart, which is questionable, why do you feel compelled to take away the only earthly possession of a person who has nothing else, not even a place to sleep or go to the bathroom? The line between you and homelessness is more narrow than you think. How many business setbacks, downsizings or injuries/illnesses that prevent you from working would it take before you were in financial difficulties? Think about that as you sit in your 'upper-middle class' living room, watching your big screen TV.User Detail :
Name : Laura22969, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Age : 38, City : Bel Air, State : MD Country : United States, Occupation : College professor, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,Nobody seems to have really answered my question. Who cares if they're poor, who cares if they're 'down and out'? It's not their legal property! Those carts can cost upwards of $750 each. A little history on my background: I grew up in the heart of Flint, MI (not exactly the richest place on earth). My mom worked three jobs just to keep a roof over our heads. But she made darn sure we kids knew that no matter what the circumstances, you never broke the law. I swore to God after seeing her work 20 hours a day sometimes that I'd make something of myself and give her a comfortable retirement, and I was able to. I know that for some, homelessness is not a choice, and I feel empathy for those people and donate time and resources to charities that help. But turning a blind eye to a 'minor' crime doesn't help anything. Last I checked, possession of stolen property was still a crime. It's not theirs!User Detail :
Name : J-Miller21303, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Atheist, Age : 26, City : Lansing, State : MI Country : United States, Occupation : Network Analyst, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Upper middle class,Boy, this subject has really touched a nerve with the original questioner. Anyway, let's assume the cop can prove the homeless person has stolen the cart from a particular store or accepted it from another party, knowing that it was stolen property. You're looking at a misdemeanor, probably a suspended jail sentence and/or a fine. Now, hopefully, that experience would rattle the person and they'd change their life of possessing hot shopping carts. But let's say the homeless person never pays the fine or complies with probation. Now, every time an officer runs a check on the person, a bench warrant on failure to comply or failure to pay fine pops up. The person is probably hauled to jail, booked in for about $140 and then released. Is this how you want our justice system to spends its resources? I don't know about where you live, but in Washington state, we face serious jail overcrowding. I'd much rather see people who need to be separated from society in jail and in our courts than a homeless person with a fondness for shopping carts. If we as a society want to punish everyone for every imaginable infraction, then we must also be willing to shell out more money to build more jails and hire more prosecutors, defense attorneys, judges, clerks and police officers. In Washington state, we have hundreds of thousands of outstanding warrants because we no longer have room in our jails. Right or wrong, it's a matter of priority.User Detail :
Name : C-Hanson, Gender : F, Race : White/Caucasian, Age : 32, City : Seattle, State : WA Country : United States, Occupation : Internet, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,It is possible that the cart does legally belong to them. I have heard of an organization in Vancouver that purchases shopping carts for use by homeless people.User Detail :
Name : CP19345, Age : 21, City : Montreal, Quebec, State : NA Country : Canada,On the contrary, everyone answered your question. You just don't like the answers and want an excuse to get angry at a group that doesn't have the economic or political means to defend itself. (How many homeless people have computers?) I want to know where you get this intense hostility to the very poor. What do you think taking carts away will do, besides create paperwork for cops? Do you really think taking the carts away or ticketing, as many cities actually DO, will 'reform' them?User Detail :
Name : ACC24001, City : W Lafayette, State : IN Country : United States,I came within inches of getting run over the other day by some yuppie in a BMW because I dared to start crossing the street when the sign said 'walk.'Choosing to pick on homeless people because they're using a cart seems to me to be a cheap shot. Let's pay more attention to those who don't need to use a cart to haul their earthly possessions around.
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Name : Brian22980, Gender : M, Race : White/Caucasian, Religion : Agnostic, Age : 33, City : Minneapolis, State : MN Country : United States, Occupation : Temp Slave, Education level : 4 Years of College, Social class : Lower middle class,If you can demonstrate that the government can recover these carts, and return them to their rightful owners, for less than $750, you might have a realistic goal. Let's say a beat officer earns as little as $30,000 a year. We'll even ignore the expense to train and insure him. That's as little as $15 per hour. Having the cart would have to get the perp ticketed, and it would need to be returned to its rightful owner in less than 30 hours. Do you think that you, acting as a private citizen, could relieve such a person of a cart and verify its true owner in four days? I don't imagine so.As for allocating the expense, even the wages of your underpaid mother were taxed. Is this how the tax money from her hard-earned wages should be spent? I would imagine that you appreciate how hard she worked enough to hope her money is spent better than that. (Insurance companies need to stay in business, too.)
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Name : Mike L., Gender : M, Race : Asian, Age : 29, City : Walnut Creek, State : CA Country : United States, Education level : 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,I think it is great that you have worked hard to make it financially. I also came from a family without much money. I worked all through high school and college to put myself through school. So I know where you are coming from. What I would like to know is, why does this shopping cart issue bother you? Yeah, homeless people probably didn't buy those shopping carts. The carts were probably taken from a store. And most homeless people live in poorer sections of town where the cops have more to do than worry about minor crimes. There is too much else going on that takes precedence over stolen shopping carts. I would rather the police spend their time cracking down on drug dealers or responding to a shooting than hassling the homeless about shopping carts.User Detail :
Name : Lucy-H22636, Gender : F, Race : Hispanic/Latino (may be any race), Age : 24, City : San Jose, State : CA Country : United States, Occupation : Engineer, Education level : 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,I find it interesting that you've only mentioned the homeless as perpetrators of the crime of 'stealing' shopping carts. What about the elderly with poor eyesight that are still mobile and semi-independent. I frequently see them 'stealing' carts from the local store so that they don't have to negotiate 15lbs of groceries and a cane for 3 blocks. And what about the mother with the infant that can't afford or doesn't have access to a car? Your argument seems to be rather discriminatory. I seem to remember something about 'walking a mile in others shoes'. I'm sure your hard-working Mom mentioned that to you at some point. In addition, I'm afraid you've over-inflated the cost of the shopping carts. It's closer to $200...User Detail :
Name : A. Adams, City : Los Angeles, State : CA Country : United States, Education level : Over 4 Years of College,I live in Downtown Atlanta. I am very sympathetic to the many homeless people who also live in the area. However, I am NOT sympathetic to the stealing of shopping carts. Supposedly the police were going to start a policy of taking away any shopping carts because the supermarkets say they NEVER sell them and so any carts on the street are stolen. Why do I care about this? I care because every time I go to Kroger Downtown there's only about one shopping cart. They keep chasing them down and they keep getting stolen. It makes me mad! I think Kroger should do what some supermarkets in Atlanta have already done, which is get carts with wheels that automatically lock up when you leave the parking lot. I don't think stealing is OK, PERIOD.User Detail :
Name : Wiebke, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Bisexual, Race : White/Caucasian, Age : 25, City : Atlanta, State : GA Country : United States, Occupation : Web Developer, Education level : 4 Years of College, Social class : Middle class,
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