[Amos-S]

I recently had dinner with a friend and her family. All are Indian Americans. I overheard a conversation about a newborn, and the family members were discussing the looks of the baby. I am pretty sure I heard one lady say, 'He has some black features.' Do Indians and Pakistanis place a value on skin complexion or lips/nose size? Are there concerns if a baby looks more African than Asian?

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Name : Amos-S, Gender : M, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : Black/African American, Religion : Episcopalian, Age : 31, City : Chicago, State : IL Country : United States, Occupation : Office Assistant, Education level : 2 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 

[ashok]

yes a lot of emphasis is placed on the complexion of the skin. this is due to the fact that the caste system which is still present in India discriminates against people who are of a darker skin.darker skin individuals are considered to be the original inhabitants of the indian subcontinent, the lighter skinned people are actually conquerers from europe and central asia who settled here thousands of years ago and established the caste system to distinguish themselves from the darker skinned natives.having a lighter skin gives a person a rank and status among the common people.it is very disturbing to see the way people in lower caste are treated

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Name : ashok, City : chicago, State : IL Country : United States, 

[Tanya]

That is quite true. Even for Indians who never leave their country, 'The lighter the skin the better.' Matrimonial ads (for people of both sexes wanting to get married) almost always use the words 'fair skin wanted.' Being darker is more acceptable in a man than a woman. I think this is true for many Asian countries, such as Japan. Other than the skin color, though, I am not aware of any preferences about nose and lip size.

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Name : Tanya, Gender : F, Age : 31, City : Washington, State : DC Country : United States, 

[Rahul M.]

I don't know why people think Indian people have African blood. Hinduism is the religion of the Indo-Aryan race. Hindus are direct descendents of the Indo-Aryan people. Feature-wise, the only difference between Indians and other Caucasians (from Europe) is skin pigmentation. In terms of facial structure (cheekbones, chin, nose, eyes), these are the same.

Indians do favor being lighter-skinned, but it's not that big of a deal. If anything, it shows that a person is from a different part of India. I'm a Bengali. My parents are from the Calcutta region. People in this area are considerably lighter than those from southern India. As you go farther south, people get darker and darker, just as you go farther north, people get lighter and lighter. People from the Calcutta area have pretty light tan skin, brown eyes, black hair. People from the south area have dark, tan skin, brown eyes, black hair. People at the most northern part of India have pale (European Caucasian color) skin, hazel eyes and brown hair. Indians from different parts do look different, and this is why people might favor lighter skin colors.

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[Madhav]

You are extremely correct about South Asians preferring fairer features in men and women. In India, most matrimonial ads specify the fairness of the individual as a kind of added qualification. I do not know why this is. I guess it has been that way since ancient times, maybe because whiteness or fairness tends to indicate a better caste. You see, in India, marriages between diverse communities are rare. We tend to marry within our communities. Most people belonging to the upper castes - 'Warrior Ksatriyas' and Brahmins, as well as people of royal descent - tend to be extremely fair. Many even look like Europeans.

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[renee30144]

i think it's sad & funny how people get so bent about skin color & facial features. if you spread out pictures of people from different cultures, you can see similarities in features & also see how features & color are adaptive to the different environments from which they come. i grew up just naturally thinking that everyone had similarities. if i happened to see an african american person who looked in some features like , say, my aunt, then she just did! it didn't matter the color of the skin. if you look at people from china across to eastern russia, you can see how asian & caucasian blend, etc, on & on... you can pick people out of anywhere on the globe that share features; i believe this points to our shared decendants. as for indian americans, i met quite a few in college who share a lot of features with the ethnic group i am from, which is albanian. the shape of the head, some facial features, & body type, etc. the albanian language is indo-european & albanians are supposed to be the oldest inhabitants of europe. what i'd like to know is, is the 'shade' preference that was explained above about indians just a natural product of human in/out group dynamics, or is it an artificial byproduct of British colonialism? (ps. in my opinion, white americans tend to be very zenophobic & it's embarassing to me to see people who are so culturely ignorant that they can't tell an indian american from a american indian, etc...i personally like to see/be around people different than me, because it's always exciting to me to discover our similarities together.)

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[Jhainine]

East Indians have a mixture of African, European and Asian blood. You can see the African in the complexion of their skin. But the thought of having any drop of African blood is scary, so you try to justify yourself by trying to be white. Everyone (including Europeans) originated in Africa.Get over it!

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[Hayat R.]

In India and Pakistan, fair skin is most definitely preferred. In recent times you can attribute it to the fact they had the British as the ruling race for hundreds of years, and of course, the 'blond-haired, blue-eyed' beauty standard of the media has reached them as well. Most dolls here are blond and blue-eyed. As far as features go, the typical cultural beauty standard is geared to large eyes, an expressive brow (some poetry has said that the eyebrow is the bow that shoots the beauty of the eye), a straight but 'Roman' nose, a well-formed mouth (they don't like big lips) and a nice chin. The allusion to black features would for a Pakistani or Indian mean the child was bad-looking in the sense that it had a wide nose and large lips.

I can give you a reason why they prefer white skin. When the Aryans invaded India many hundreds of years ago, India was not a mixed society as it is now. The race there was 'Druvidian,' which is what most South Indians are. The Aryans, invaders from the Caucus mountains, brought with them the fair features preferred today. The pale skin, lighter eyes and hair were the hallmarks of the ruling class. Through time, India/Pakistan has become a much more cosmopolitan society, with the rulers, whether the Aryans or the Raj, marrying women from all cultures and mixing the lines. However, that racial mixing really hasn't spread to the far south, and in the north of Pakistan, people are as 'Anglo'-looking as any American, with green/blue/hazel eyes, brown/blond/red hair and angled bone structure.

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Name : Hayat R., Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : Caucasian/Asian mix, Religion : Muslim, Age : 20, City : Islamabad, State : NA Country : Pakistan, Occupation : Journalist, Education level : 2 Years of College, Social class : Middle class, 

[Chuck D]

Im an african american and i will say this its funny how people of color come here to the Us and want to be white, and mistreat people in the black community because they automatically want to be white, It doesnt matter how light some of you are and how european your features your are not white, and its a shame that you have such a narrowed minded culture that you want to embrace these , ignorant mindsets, I think people of color are the most beautiful people on the planet and its a shame people have so much self hate, and not only that hate for other races who are more like them than europeans.And for the record all races stem from the African continent, it is the mother of the earth, but people such as indians asians and hindus , want to hate on people of color , even in thier own culture this is , sick , but let me say that this will not wash here in the us and the racism that hindus , arabs and asians, want to exhibit towards blacks here will be dealt with in the future , im sure of exposing the ignorance of these cultures and their inbreed racism.

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[Sandy B]

While there isn't much I can add to the responses, I have to reiterate that colorism and even racism is alive and well in India. Dravidians were a race of people (black, small in stature, angular-round features) who emigrated from Africa to inhabit India. There are other ethnic groups in India that can be physiologically differentiated from each other. As for the non-black preference: The Aryans imposed the caste system on India such that light skin was favored over dark skin. Dravidians were relegated to 'untouchable' and low caste positions, which also largely took away opportunities for education and advancement. This institutionalized racism and colorism. While Dravidian culture considered black as beautiful, their culture has been assimilated or destroyed. British colonization exacerbated the situation. You can see the effects of colorism on India to this day. It is evident in the large market for 'skin bleach.' Also, take a look at who is in the Bollywood movies and who isn't, definitely not dark-skinned starlets. Many Indians hope that their children are not born with dark or non-Aryan features both because of their internalized racism and also because of the reality of society. Kids with those features will usually be less favored than kids with Aryan features and lighter skin. From what I have seen, this kind of thinking has become like second-nature. Because India can be considered mixed-race, you may call this colorism rather than racism. Personally, I feel the plight of Dravidians needs to be connected to that of Black people in general. In addition, you probably shouldn't hesitate to see the discrimination latent in the statements made by those Indians.

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[Madhuri]

Oh Please Rahul, I have met tons of Bengalis that are extremely dark. I am a fair skinned south indian. You north Indians need to stop thinking that you are the only ones who are fair skinned. South Indians from Andhra Pradesh and Karnataka are very fair many of the times. Aishwarya Rai is south indian.give me a break..She is considered one of the most beautiful women in the world. Stop generalizing. Oh bengalis are not that fair. My friend who is bengali is dark as night.

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[Nandini]

Excuse me, I am south Indian and have light skin and green eyes. Besides Aishwarya Rai is south indian as well. As well as countless actresses. Honestly speaking Bengalis can be darker, look at Bipasha or Rani. Generalizations are moot point..usually said by imbeciles.

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Name : Nandini, Gender : F, Sexual Orientation : Straight, Race : East Indian, Religion : Hindu, Age : 27, City : Suburbs, State : PA Country : United States, Education level : Over 4 Years of College, Social class : Upper middle class, 

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